Lactic Peel reactions
Hi All,
I am pretty good with chemical peels, enzyme peels ect. Truth is I had never used the lactic peel before, and the spa I work for ordered it. I had been reading wonderful things about it, so I decided to use it on my best friend, who has had all the possible things I can put on her skin, with no problems at all. Well, she had a bad break out, about a week after. Small pimples everywhere.
So I decided to never use it again. However, after so so so many good reviews about it, I came up with the conclusion that I probably did something wrong. So, last week here I am again, following every single step of the protocol, and a week later same result-irritation.
Has anyone had problems with the peel? Any suggestions, or any idea of what could be the problem?
Thanks,
Maria
Tags: chemical, lactic, peel, peels
Views: 1229
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Sheila Gordon on
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I agree with Cindy and seeing as anyone can buy these, I bet the ph is higher. They can't legally sell these peels and have them affective to people without a license. check out the lactic peel from Skin Scripts or Control Correctives has a lactic green tea (haven't tried that one but would like to) but I LOVE skin scripts lactic. I have used Glo Therapeutics blueberry lactic as well and is much like the SKin Scripts blueberry enzyme.
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Permalink Reply by maria mihaylova on
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I sure will try them, Thank you very much!
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Permalink Reply by coldsalineplexus on
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Incorrect. There is no legal barrier to selling products to the public that we as licensed professionals consider to be "professional-only" products. HOWEVER there is a strong liability-based reason that most companies would choose not to sell potentially harmful products to the general public. It all depends on the company, their business model, and how much risk they are willing to undertake.
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Permalink Reply by Marty Glenn on
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Maria,
Well you received some good responses but I wanted to comment on two:
The first is your use of steam. There are so many opinions but from my research there is never a need for steam to be used with a chemical peel and the ability for steam to induce a deeper peel is not accurate. Heat and or humidity, which steam is, actually causes skin cells to thicken so if your method of penetration was actually a sweat gland (eccerine or apocrine) then they would be closed or should I say the cells would swell and shorten the area of absorption. Also, without a proper period of pre peel protocol, depending on skin condition, you would actually have a thicker skin type which would also reduce penetration.
The other point I would like to make is actually a double point. I did not see the pH value mentioned and that is actually more important then the percentage at times (most of the time on percentages from 30 - 50%) and the second is the use of pre peel products. It is true that 1% or so of the population is allergic to AHAs but in this case if you had prescribed a pre peel home protocol you would have noticed the reaction BEFORE the peel and saved both you and your client a lot of stress and worry.
Just some thoughts...
Marty
SkinCareScience.com
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Marty, let me just say this, your reply is printed and pined on the board in the break room. Thank you very much for the detailed explanation. Since you know so much about it, let me ask you one more thing. I did not use the steam, I mentioned it previously because it was one of the explanations I got, and I decided it may be a good FYI. I followed the protocol, and two times in a row I have the same reaction on the same person. What do you think about it? And you are absolutely right about the pre-treatment protocol. We were all talking about it today. We should incorporate it.
One very interesting thing that came out of all this, is that the ph is not stated on the bottle or the safety data. sheet. They are separated in levels, the first one being the highest ph, which I assume is 3.5. We left a message for the rep with this question.
Oh, and we checked your site, and all the estheticians at the spa were chit-chatting about presenting it to the owners.
Thank you so much!
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Maria,
-- Thank you for your kind words… I appreciate them. Sometimes my thoughts are not always the most welcomed in the room. --
It is always tough to comment when your not actually there with the client / pro, so please consider what I say as trying to help and just a thought. I do not want to offend any professional. :)
I don’t know the protocol with that peel but 35% at 3.5 pH is not a strong peel. Lactic acid is the lighter AHA and then you have a 3.5pH which is close to 3.8-4.0pH and at that high of a pH it is almost not even an acid. (research ‘kp value of an acid’ to understand this and don’t feel bad if you don’t get it, neither do I really :} )
Look to the gel component of the peel as the starting point of your issue. Time required for the peel might have been 3 – 5 minutes depending on protocol but how did you remove the gel and neutralize the acid? My guess is that once the timer dinged the gel was wiped and the wiping occurred from the forehead down, but the elapsed time then continued to the post 5 minute mark (just guessing on time) and even then residual acid was still acting on the skin. Then again (just guessing) but water or a post peel balm was then applied then occluding (balm covering skin) the residual lactic acid and the acid was still only diluted (water and balm would dilute the acid but not neutralize it) but still acting on the skin.
I think the client and the professional were very luck since I think the peel was active on the skin for up to 10 minutes or even more based on what you have said. So even a 35% lactic acid at 3.5pH could really cause issues with a sensitive skin type and look like the 1% who are allergic but actually is something else.
Marty
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Marty, when I grow up I wanna be like you :)
You would probably not be surprised when I tell you that you nailed it. It was the neutralizing part that I did wrong, not on purpose, and I am not gonna tell you the long story, but after I red your post, I went through the whole box(the peel stay in protected boxes) and I found out that in fact I fail with that step, shame on me, twice I did not pay attention that I was using a toner, not the neutralizer. These bottles are exactly the same...and that's when the long story begins, but it is still my responsibility.
Thank God we are required to do several practices on even the most simple facial, before doing one on a client. Of course, after I told my friend, who is the one that I was practicing on with the lactic peel (an employee of the spa) what I had done, she told me that she will drop her son at my house, so she can have a night out, as a pay off. So, thanks to you, I will be running after two toddler boys.
How come you don't do web seminars or something like that? I would be a student for each one of them. I saw on your website that you guys have on site classes, but nothing on line.
I hope you are doing well, thank you so much for your help. I am so glad I posted my question here and you took your time to answer. I got down to the bottom of that lactic peel mystery.
Thank you!
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Maria.
I am sure there are some pros who read this thread and said: “Thank god I read that thread”, and others who said, “really, you did what?” You’re a hero in my eyes. Many pros don’t even take the time to admit the mistake. So kudos…
Glad I could help. Toddlers? Yes that might just be payback.
The main point is if you had someone poor some acid (first Number) in a beaker and then water (Second Number) in a 1:1 or even 1:2 and then applied the liquid to your face and it burned, you would know that water only dilutes the acid. But then if you did the same test with a neutralizer and you actually heard and saw the chemical reaction, (Repeated the test again – felt no burn) you would never look at the procedure of a chemical peel the same way (i.e. you would have looked first for the acid then second for the neutralizer). Try it with your lactic acid. It should really fiz and bubble.
Here is a good one regarding TCA peels. Most pros are afraid of them, right? Does not matter the percentage; they just know they are afraid. Horror stories… Internet scarring pictures… Want to know one reason TCA can be scary?
It’s a good one: YOU MUST SHAKE THE BOTTLE BEFORE EACH USE
TCA settles and separates into pockets of different strengths within itself in the bottle. The TCA molecule is very mobile when settled. So if you dropper or poor out .5 oz for a peel and you did not gently shake it first, you could actually be getting higher concentrations then you think and what was before a 15% (3 coat) TCA peel is now a 25% (3 coat) peel. Big difference.
Make sure you experience salicylic acid frosting before you try TCA or learn about it. It will help.
Webinars? Not so sure... Lots of those out there as well as you tube videos. Custom is 1 on 1 or like this. Maybe I feel this way is more fitting of my style.
Marty
SkinCareScience.com
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Seriously Marty, I would change my google bar for you, if there is a chance. You should have some kid of app for the smart phones, or a direct problem solving line :)
Well, not that I am going to try to change your mind, but what youtube videos you're talking about? The ones with these funny girls giving advice how to apply TCA and have no idea what TCA means? The eshteticians need you!!! :)
Or here is another idea, a class once a month, or even once every two months, although I would have one once a week. My point is, unfortunately, there are a lot of us, who forget about the fact that there is somebody, who studied more than us, and knows more, usually called a doctor. Just like some doctors cross the line with pricey suggestions that don't work. Learning does never stop in any profession, and there are also a lot of us who want to really understand what are we doing, not only what the product line is telling us to do. And here is where YOU come in, with this spectacular way of explaining.
If you still don't consider having some kind of distance educations, then allow me to inform you, that you would be having me asking you something very often. I will inbox you, because the lactic peel dilemma is over.
Thank you very much for your new tip about TCA, and that's a big example of what I was talking about-I knew about the shaking, I didn't know why.
And also, thank you for your kind words. I am honored! To me, admitting a mistake is the short cut to the success, although sometimes it doesn't look like.
I hope you're doing very well.
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Thank you. Again, glad I could help. Any time...
Marty
SkinCareScience.com
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Marty, how are you? I have a question for you, I tried to inbox you, and I was required to become your friend first...long story short, HEEELP!
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Maria
Hope I can help or at least give you ideas...
Marty
SkinCareScience.com
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